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PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:40 pm 
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animal-friendly wrote:
Wayne Stollings wrote:
animal-friendly wrote:
She may be charged with "mischief' in the meddling of animals being transported in some discomfort.


"Some discomfort"? What discomfort did they suffer in that short drive exactly? It was not too hot according to the weather data. It was not too cold or wet either. They were not deprived of food or water for an extended period. According to the news reports she WAS charged and lied through their teeth to the reporters, who did not bother to check the facts.

She will probably be charged with "mischief". In other words, she will be let off for a minor transgression. It was not "too" hot, but very likely uncomfortable & the pigs very likely thirsty. They drank greedily, obviously in need of what was given.

Quote:
We will see what that discomfort is, beyond transportation.


Beyond transportation? Transportation was the only aspect of the video and now because they were caught misrepresenting that whole thing they are going to try to make up something else? That is was lawyers do when trying to defend their clients, but it does not make it any more factual than the last attempt

It was the aspect of the video the activist were drawing attention to. But they don't have to make up anything else. The facts will speak for themselves, and those facts are actually part of the defense. In other words, yes! You are correct, the issue and case will definitely involve more than the transportation issue. It will address the entire issue, from transportation, to slaughter, and all the ugly "realities" in between. You have read the details of the case, have you not?

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Obviously, the transport is reasonably disputed
,

"Reasonably"? No, it is disputed but given the way it was disputed there is nothing reasonable about it. IT is not an attempt to make the transport better, but to end the transport and use of the animals for food.

Oh please ..... there is a massive movement that is becoming informed of, and moving away from, mass corporate means. This may be a 'vegan" issue for many, but for many more it is a question of basic rationality. To incarcerate animals in this way is neither rational nor logical. The food system, in its entirety, is incoherent .... but to include animals in this mass production and consumption? Tsk. OF COURSE it's more than just transportation, although transportation is a large issue to be tackled and challenged.

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A very dishonest approach which is taken far too often. Now it appears ALL of the things said about how the Canadian transport regulations should be more like the European transport regulations was just a big smoke screen designed to lie to the people who did not know the facts of the matter. That too is FAR TOO COMMON with groups like this. If there were issues with the Canadian transport regulations they have lost any independent support for changing them when this set of misrepresentations is included.



The people who did not know the facts of the matter? What, like Europe has a much more humane system of transportation? Their actions have galvanized many, and have educated the majority who had NO IDEA of what is involved in their luxury food.

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and the treatment of animals upon delivery may also be called into question.


Quote:
Everything will be called into question, I am sure. The problem is there seems to be no facts behind the questions other than a personal agenda.


So you DO know that everything will be called into question and that was the point?


Yes, a stunt based on lies and misrepresentations from the start.

Quote:
And you pretend that this action will threaten the yak burgers of the world?


No, it should set the AR movement back as a whole once the level of deceit is exposed.

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Or that calling on a more sane, rational treatment of animals ... animals .... will threaten your well being?


By using lies and misrepresentations? I would not believe anything they claim at this point.

Quote:
Will you die? Of course we all will, but it is the living that matters and the quality of life while living is taking place.


The quality of living where you have to lie to try to make your point seems flawed to me, but they seem to think it makes their case and it does but it makes it for the
ones they oppose. The AR movement has a far too long history of making up situations to think any video or information that is presented is not heavily edited or staged in some manner. We now know that is the case with this video as well.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 7:14 am 
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Quote:
We will see what that discomfort is, beyond transportation.


Beyond transportation? That is was lawyers do when trying to defend their clients, but it does not make it any more factual than the last attempt.

Like bacon is yummy? Will your lawyer defend that? Society will, so your lawyer will probably follow. S/he probably had it for breakfast.

In other words, yes! You are correct, the issue and case will definitely involve more than the transportation issue. It will address the entire issue, from transportation, to slaughter, and all the ugly "realities" in between. You have read the details of the case, have you not? Obviously, the transport is reasonably disputed.

"Reasonably"? No, it is disputed but given the way it was disputed there is nothing reasonable about it. IT is not an attempt to make the transport better, but to end the transport and use of the animals for food.

(because bacon is yummy?) And convenient?

There is a massive movement that is becoming informed of, and moving away from, mass corporate means. This may be a 'vegan" issue for many, but for many more it is a question of basic rationality. To incarcerate animals in this way is neither rational nor logical. The food system, in its entirety, is incoherent .... but to include animals in this mass production and consumption? Tsk. OF COURSE it's more than just transportation, although transportation is a large issue to be tackled and challenged.

"A very dishonest approach which is taken far too often. Now it appears ALL of the things said about how the Canadian transport regulations should be more like the European transport regulations was just a big smoke screen designed to lie to the people who did not know the facts of the matter. That too is FAR TOO COMMON with groups like this. If there were issues with the Canadian transport regulations they have lost any independent support for changing them when this set of misrepresentations is included."

The idea is clear. No dishonesty there. Cuz beacon strips (Goes with eggs?) We are not living in small farms anymore. And it's not just a Canadian issue.

Europe has a much more humane system of transportation? Their actions have galvanized many, and have educated the majority who had NO IDEA of what is involved in their luxury food.

"Everything will be called into question, I am sure. The problem is there seems to be no facts behind the questions other than a personal agenda".

Personal agenda of bacon and eggs? Bacon is all the rage these days. Trendy. Will you die if these pigs aren't transported en masse?

So you DO know that everything will be called into question and that was the point?

Of course.

And you pretend that this action will threaten the yak burgers of the world?

"No, it should set the AR movement back as a whole once the level of deceit is exposed. '

I don't consider myself a part of the "AR movement", yet am well aware of the economy and how animals factor into it.
Will you die if you don't eat the product? Obviously not. Or that calling on a more sane, rational treatment of animals ... animals .... will threaten your well being?

"By using lies and misrepresentations? I would not believe anything they claim at this point."

Really? There has been ample evidence of extreme abuse. Should we believe you instead? You, who adhere to the so called advice the industries that call for animals as the only source of protein? No other sources of protein? Must it come from animals? Great source of GNP, keeps people employed, creates jobs.

They are simply reporting. Will you only have bacon and eggs? Or else you will die? Survival or bust?

"The quality of living where you have to lie to try to make your point seems flawed to me,"

You call this "quality of living"? How is this quality?
What would happen if you didn't consume said product? Would you perish? Would you die?


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 8:32 am 
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animal-friendly wrote:
Quote:
We will see what that discomfort is, beyond transportation.


Beyond transportation? That is was lawyers do when trying to defend their clients, but it does not make it any more factual than the last attempt. (like bacon is yummy?)


But that is supposedly YOUR case that there is some unknown and horrible level of discomfort in transporting hogs an hour in a truck where the temperature never got above 80 F.

Quote:
It was the aspect of the video the activist were drawing attention to.


Yes and without a lot of the information surrounding the situation. We like to call those staged videos because, well they are staged to present something not very truthful.

Quote:
But they don't have to make up anything else.


They just had to leave out all of the important information and hope people reached the wrong conclusion. Lying by omission is still lying.

Quote:
The facts will speak for themselves, and those facts are actually part of the defense. In other words, yes!


The fact that they interfered with the transport? The fact the situation presented in the video is implausible given the totality of the information?

Quote:
You are correct, the issue and case will definitely involve more than the transportation issue. It will address the entire issue, from transportation, to slaughter, and all the ugly "realities" in between. You have read the details of the case, have you not?


Yes, and the ugly "realities" have no bearing on the case other than an attempt to use the staged video as a means to make the claims. So much for your "wanting to change the transport regulations" right? Lies are such horrible things when they impact your credibility.

Quote:
Quote:
Obviously, the transport is reasonably disputed



"Reasonably"? No, it is disputed but given the way it was disputed there is nothing reasonable about it. IT is not an attempt to make the transport better, but to end the transport and use of the animals for food.


There we have the truth. You lied so well about changing the transport regulations and how the goal was to improve them and now we see the truth and you have lost all possible credibility for anything.

Quote:
(because bacon is yummy?)


It is. Here we have something called a "pig pickin" where a whole hog is roasted for hours over a slow fire. We just had another one as a hurricane party. There is nothing like the taste.

Quote:
There is a massive movement that is becoming informed of, and moving away from, mass corporate means.


You mean lied to as you have done to us here?

Quote:
This may be a 'vegan" issue for many, but for many more it is a question of basic rationality. To incarcerate animals in this way is neither rational nor logical. The food system, in its entirety, is incoherent .... but to include animals in this mass production and consumption? Tsk. OF COURSE it's more than just transportation, although transportation is a large issue to be tackled and challenged.


Good luck with that. I would not believe a word of that now. You see when you lie you show that you have no honor and without any honor you cannot be believed.

Quote:
"A very dishonest approach which is taken far too often. Now it appears ALL of the things said about how the Canadian transport regulations should be more like the European transport regulations was just a big smoke screen designed to lie to the people who did not know the facts of the matter. That too is FAR TOO COMMON with groups like this. If there were issues with the Canadian transport regulations they have lost any independent support for changing them when this set of misrepresentations is included."


Quote:
The idea is clear. No dishonesty there.


Other than the lies about this being to update the transport regulations, the conditions of the hogs, etc.

Quote:
Cuz beacon strips? ( Goes with eggs?) We are not living in small farms anymore.


No, and we are not growing our own wheat and corn either. Small farms have NO oversight of their animal welfare either, so you can drop the lie that you would accept it if we were.

Quote:
What, like Europe has a much more humane system of transportation? Their actions have galvanized many, and have educated the majority who had NO IDEA of what is involved in their luxury food.


You mean by lying to them too?

Quote:
Quote:
and the treatment of animals upon delivery may also be called into question.


"Everything will be called into question, I am sure. The problem is there seems to be no facts behind the questions other than a personal agenda".


Quote:
Personal agenda of bacon and eggs? Bacon is all the rage these days. Trendy.


So you have to lie to try to get ahead of the trend? Good luck with that.


Quote:
Quote:
And you pretend that this action will threaten the yak burgers of the world?


"No, it should set the AR movement back as a whole once the level of deceit is exposed. '


Quote:
I don't consider myself a part of the "AR movement", yet am well aware of the economy and how animals factor into it.


Now you are lying to yourself? I suppose you have to do that to be able to lie to everyone else so effectively.

Quote:
Will you die if you don't eat the product? Obviously not.


It contains a natural source of B-12 which will kill me if I do not get it. There is no other natural source outside of animal products. So you either support big business making your B-12 which the last time I checked was produced by bacteria grown in huge vats of milk.

Quote:
Or that calling on a more sane, rational treatment of animals ... animals .... will threaten your well being?



You say sane and rational yet you have lied to us before so why should we believe you now? I do not.

Quote:
Quote:
"By using lies and misrepresentations? I would not believe anything they claim at this point."


They are simply reporting.


They are simply reporting LIES and MISREPRESENTATIONS and you are too.

Quote:
Will you only have bacon and eggs?


No, I will also have sausage and biscuits.

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Or else you will die?


Everything dies. Not everything dies with a purpose. Not everyone dies with honor.

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Survival or bust?



Survival works for me.

Quote:
Quote:
"The quality of living where you have to lie to try to make your point seems flawed to me,"


You call this "quality of living"? How is this quality?


I do not call it quality because you are reduced to lying as your "quality" which is far from any quality I would want. You are free to lie as much as you want.

Quote:
What would happen if you didn't consume said product? Would you perish? Would you die?


So you would propose eliminating all but the basic shelter, clothing, and food? Of course you do because that rational applied to human life would remove all but the basic survival levels of everything because someone will have a problem and we will have to try to appease their hurt feelings.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 6:11 am 
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Cuz beacon strips? ( Goes with eggs?) We are not living in small farms anymore.


"No, and we are not growing our own wheat and corn either. Small farms have NO oversight of their animal welfare either, so you can drop the lie that you would accept it if we were."

We did not abuse animals when we were living on smaller farms. Hint


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 8:37 am 
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animal-friendly wrote:
Cuz beacon strips? ( Goes with eggs?) We are not living in small farms anymore.


"No, and we are not growing our own wheat and corn either. Small farms have NO oversight of their animal welfare either, so you can drop the lie that you would accept it if we were."

We did not abuse animals when we were living on smaller farms. Hint


Yes we did and some still do to this day. That is why animal welfare laws have been around for a very long time.

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