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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 12:36 pm 
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The spending by states shows they were spending other people's money to hire contractors for state projects or programs. I know Colorado is in trouble financially from over-spending, and the USA for sure.
The 22 million Americans out of work right now corresponds to the amount of illegals employed under the table or with phony IDs. There are several more million collecting various government hand outs that were meant for citizens but given, through corruption, to illegals. The first post shows Americans standing in line for jobs vacated by leaving illegals.
Other posts show the laws broken, and fines for violation. I think a certain amount of Americans could be employed as bounty hunters to collect the fines from violators, and others to drive the buses for deep Eisenhower type deportation, and more on the borders and coasts. This would energize the economy while paying off the debt with the collected fines and taxes paid by legit Americans working again.
The USA certainly doesn't need more people when the max sustainable is between 50 and 200 million depending on standard of living. =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 2:53 pm 
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Fosgate wrote:
I'm not suggesting there is relation at all. Just another way to look at it. Market gets tough, it gets tougher to find a job. I don't have that problem but then, folks like me put as much distance between themselves and unemployment as possible while we are employed. You know what I mean! :razz:

As for the numbers, yeah, increased spending seems to have offset a downward trend. It's still a weak correlation and not one I'd use in support of any point.


Other than the point cutting spending does not seem to create jobs?

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:50 pm 
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Wayne Stollings wrote:
Other than the point cutting spending does not seem to create jobs?


If we're dealing in points that hinge on that which seems, then I suppose so. Sorry I thought the pool was a little deeper. #-o :razz:

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 4:00 pm 
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Fosgate wrote:
Wayne Stollings wrote:
Other than the point cutting spending does not seem to create jobs?


If we're dealing in points that hinge on that which seems, then I suppose so. Sorry I thought the pool was a little deeper. #-o :razz:


No, without seeing more of the data and the confidence levels of the statisitics it is hard for me to make hard claims. Economics are always a little wonky since there are so many factors in play and most everything is subjective. There may be cases where cutting spending would create jobs, as anything is possible. :mrgreen: :razz: :razz:

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 5:42 pm 
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Wayne Stollings wrote:
animal-friendly wrote:
Wayne Stollings wrote:
There seems to be a connection between state budget cuts and increased private unemployment ....

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2011/0 ... ding-jobs/

Image



Would you do us all a favor here ..... and interpret/explain? I kind of get a certain level of dysfunction in this .... but I may be off.
Please, take your time ....

AF


Sure, the data from 49 states (Alabama is not included) on the governmental spending, employment rate, and other economic indicators and compared to determine the actual trends. The chart compared the level of spending increase/decrease from the national average to the level of employment change from the national average for each of the states. The data indicated the states who increased spending also increased employment (including private sector growth) while states that cut spending decreased employment (including private sector decline) during the same recovery period. This indicates the stimulus concept works, but only in relation to the amount spent. This is important because of the current push to lower the deficit to "create jobs", which is a concept not supported by the data.

From the attached article:

From the start of the Great Recession in December 2007 through the end of 2010, 24 states have cut government spending by an average of 7.5 percent after adjusting for inflation. Another 25 states have expanded government outlays by an average of 11 percent. (The analysis excludes Alabama due to data problems reported by the National Association of State Budget Offices). And the differences in these states’ economic performance could not be more self-evident. Relative to national economic trends, states that increased spending enjoyed on average:

•0.2 percentage point decrease in the unemployment rate
•1.4 percent increase in private employment
•0.5 percent real economic growth since the start of the recession
In contrast, states that cut spending saw on average

•1 percentage point increase in the unemployment rate
•2.1 percent loss of private employment
•2.9 percent real economic contraction relative to the national economic trend

Steep state spending cuts have gone hand-in-hand with rising unemployment rates, falling private-sector payroll employment, and lower growth in state’s gross domestic product, or GDP — the sum of all goods and services produced by labor and equipment in each state, less imports.



Oops. So sorry. I completely overlooked the link and only saw the extremely busy graph. I could have just as easily read the darn article. My bad!
:crazy:
Anyway, the same site includes a few other interesting articles. One about how Goldman Sachs took a $10 billion dollar bailout and is now EXPORTING 1000 jobs to Singapore, and another about there being no historical evidence to show that not taxing big business leads to more jobs.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 6:48 am 
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animal-friendly wrote:
Oops. So sorry. I completely overlooked the link and only saw the extremely busy graph. I could have just as easily read the darn article. My bad!
:crazy:
Anyway, the same site includes a few other interesting articles. One about how Goldman Sachs took a $10 billion dollar bailout and is now EXPORTING 1000 jobs to Singapore, and another about there being no historical evidence to show that not taxing big business leads to more jobs.


No probelm. It did promote more discussion on the data.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 7:29 am 
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Wayne Stollings wrote:
No, without seeing more of the data and the confidence levels of the statisitics it is hard for me to make hard claims. Economics are always a little wonky since there are so many factors in play and most everything is subjective. There may be cases where cutting spending would create jobs, as anything is possible. :mrgreen: :razz: :razz:


Phooey then! :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 7:41 am 
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Fosgate wrote:
Wayne Stollings wrote:
No, without seeing more of the data and the confidence levels of the statisitics it is hard for me to make hard claims. Economics are always a little wonky since there are so many factors in play and most everything is subjective. There may be cases where cutting spending would create jobs, as anything is possible. :mrgreen: :razz: :razz:


Phooey then! :lol:


You could try the statistical analysis of tea leaf reading as a discussion point ...... \:D/ :-#

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 7:45 am 
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Or better yet you could discuss the Jupiter System of Force and how it causes global warming and earthquakes with Wardengineering on TES ..... talk about pool depth, mosquito larva cannot survive in that pool.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:01 am 
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Wayne Stollings wrote:
You could try the statistical analysis of tea leaf reading as a discussion point ...... \:D/ :-#


It'd be about as good, but I do like tea now. Don't tempt me. Problem is, the coffee pot's always full and I'm just lazy that way. 8)

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:59 am 
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Fosgate wrote:
Wayne Stollings wrote:
You could try the statistical analysis of tea leaf reading as a discussion point ...... \:D/ :-#


It'd be about as good, but I do like tea now. Don't tempt me. Problem is, the coffee pot's always full and I'm just lazy that way. 8)


I so rarely drink coffee, but then I keep a stash of Earl Grey at work and in my travel case to be sure. I will tear up some Southern sweet tea in the summer .... and spring .... and fall ..... and most of the winter too.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:09 am 
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I should probably lay off. After 3 or 4 mugs of it, breakfast, and my flintstone vitamins, I feel awesome. BP's running 143/93 though and that's with meds to keep it low. Gonna have a meltdown!

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:16 am 
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Fosgate wrote:
I should probably lay off. After 3 or 4 mugs of it, breakfast, and my flintstone vitamins, I feel awesome. BP's running 143/93 though and that's with meds to keep it low. Gonna have a meltdown!


My wife used to have trouble with the automatic BP cuffs in the hospital because they could not read her BP. It was always so low they had to do it manually until the auto cuffs improved. Now with some of her meds it lowers her BP but even the autocuff we have at home picks it up. Mine is usually borderline around a white coat and just under when I do it at home. The 80 mg aspirin seemed to bump it up a little for some reason. I would have thought the opposite would have happened but who knows.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:34 am 
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It's weird. I'm looking through my past readings right now. When my heart rate is good, hovering around 70, but my BP is up, like now. My BP goes down, my heart rate shoots up to 90-100. Wow, here's one where my heart rate was 159 bpm.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2011 4:05 am 
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Wayne Stollings wrote:
animal-friendly wrote:
Oops. So sorry. I completely overlooked the link and only saw the extremely busy graph. I could have just as easily read the darn article. My bad!
:crazy:
Anyway, the same site includes a few other interesting articles. One about how Goldman Sachs took a $10 billion dollar bailout and is now EXPORTING 1000 jobs to Singapore, and another about there being no historical evidence to show that not taxing big business leads to more jobs.


No probelm. It did promote more discussion on the data.



Yeah. Fear creates and promotes a certain kind of irratinality. It constricts.


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