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PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 9:17 pm 
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sianblooz wrote:
I was going to just ignore this as its nothing but yet another attempt on your part to raise hell on the board. But, you dragged my name into it.

This is not the way you told this story before. Its also not the way you told it from the other board. I haven't read all of that thread because its one of those that goes on for miles. I don't have that link and have no interest in reading any more of this frankly disturbing story.

I think what you've written this time is self-serving pap and aimed at stirring the pot.

IF what you say is true, I agree the kitten needed killing. I don't know or care which version is true. There are so many holes in each version and its a waste of time to try to sort it all out.

Looks like you're up for Parent Of The Year Award though. :roll:

FYI, my own daughter is very close in age to yours. I would do damn near anything to protect her from seeing her own kitten beaten to death. I guess I'm just not the attentive parentyou are.



As much as I am against this type of euthanasia (more than anyone here I would wager, except maybe arc and 1 or 2 others), I don't think the kitten was beaten to death. Realistically speaking, it was, but we know it was done to end its suffering and nothing more. I try to remember (lately anyway) that my background and present situation are different from "country folk" - those who hunt, raise livestock, slaughter their own animals, and euthanize their own animals. There are plenty on this board who do all of those things. Doesn't mean it's wrong or they are being malicious. Just something I've never been exposed to and it's unsettling. Personally, I would have taken the kitten to the vet. Yes, it would have prolonged its misery, but on the other hand I'm up at 6 am everyday so I would have found it sooner than wijim did.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 9:47 pm 
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sianblooz wrote:
FYI, my own daughter is very close in age to yours. I would do damn near anything to protect her from seeing her own kitten beaten to death. I guess I'm just not the attentive parentyou are.


IOW, your child will grow up very sheltered and naive. To each their own, but that is part of why I think children are such pansies these days. My sister is tougher than 90% of the boys she went to school with. Boys aren't raised to be men, and girls aren't raised to be women these days.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 9:49 pm 
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Grace wrote:
I try to remember (lately anyway) that my background and present situation are different from "country folk" - those who hunt, raise livestock, slaughter their own animals, and euthanize their own animals. There are plenty on this board who do all of those things. Doesn't mean it's wrong or they are being malicious. Just something I've never been exposed to and it's unsettling.


That's a good thing to remember. At least you've got an open mind.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 9:53 pm 
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Grace wrote:
As much as I am against this type of euthanasia (more than anyone here I would wager, except maybe arc and 1 or 2 others), I don't think the kitten was beaten to death. Realistically speaking, it was, but we know it was done to end its suffering and nothing more. I try to remember (lately anyway) that my background and present situation are different from "country folk" - those who hunt, raise livestock, slaughter their own animals, and euthanize their own animals. There are plenty on this board who do all of those things. Doesn't mean it's wrong or they are being malicious. Just something I've never been exposed to and it's unsettling.


Good post Grace. :wink:


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 9:55 pm 
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Archer wrote:
sianblooz wrote:
FYI, my own daughter is very close in age to yours. I would do damn near anything to protect her from seeing her own kitten beaten to death. I guess I'm just not the attentive parentyou are.


IOW, your child will grow up very sheltered and naive. To each their own, but that is part of why I think children are such pansies these days. My sister is tougher than 90% of the boys she went to school with. Boys aren't raised to be men, and girls aren't raised to be women these days.


I agree to a certain extent that overkill is occurring when it comes to protecting "the chirrun."


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 10:00 pm 
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Bean wrote:
Archer wrote:
sianblooz wrote:
FYI, my own daughter is very close in age to yours. I would do damn near anything to protect her from seeing her own kitten beaten to death. I guess I'm just not the attentive parentyou are.


IOW, your child will grow up very sheltered and naive. To each their own, but that is part of why I think children are such pansies these days. My sister is tougher than 90% of the boys she went to school with. Boys aren't raised to be men, and girls aren't raised to be women these days.


I agree to a certain extent that overkill is occurring when it comes to protecting "the chirrun."


Now, that doesn't mean that they should see anything and everything, and the things they need to see should come only after they reach an appropriate age. But most people censor way too much of the things they need to see while allowing them to see what they don't need to see, IMHO.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 10:34 pm 
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Archer wrote:
Grace wrote:
I try to remember (lately anyway) that my background and present situation are different from "country folk" - those who hunt, raise livestock, slaughter their own animals, and euthanize their own animals. There are plenty on this board who do all of those things. Doesn't mean it's wrong or they are being malicious. Just something I've never been exposed to and it's unsettling.


That's a good thing to remember. At least you've got an open mind.


Indeed.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 11:04 pm 
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Archer wrote:
sianblooz wrote:
FYI, my own daughter is very close in age to yours. I would do damn near anything to protect her from seeing her own kitten beaten to death. I guess I'm just not the attentive parentyou are.


IOW, your child will grow up very sheltered and naive. To each their own, but that is part of why I think children are such pansies these days. My sister is tougher than 90% of the boys she went to school with. Boys aren't raised to be men, and girls aren't raised to be women these days.


Here we go again.

I said
Quote:
I would do damn near anything to protect her from seeing her own kitten beaten to death.
but what you read is that she
Quote:
will grow up very sheltered and naive
.

How do you figure? What makes you think you know enough about MY DAUGHTER or the way I've raised her that you can categorically state that she
Quote:
will grow up very sheltered and naive.


Then you say
Quote:
Now, that doesn't mean that they should see anything and everything, and the things they need to see should come only after they reach an appropriate age.


Ok, what age is "appropriate" for MY DAUGHTER to watch someone beat her kitten to death? (Jeezus H Krist - especially her own FATHER !)

Not your daughter and not wijim's daughter.

MY DAUGHTER.

Quote:
Boys aren't raised to be men, and girls aren't raised to be women these days.


Are you saying that watching your father beat your kitten to death without batting an eye means you're being raised to be a "man" ? a "woman"?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:22 am 
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sianblooz wrote:
Are you saying that watching your father beat your kitten to death without batting an eye means you're being raised to be a "man" ? a "woman"?


It doesn't matter what age she is. If she is old enough to have a kitten, then she is old enough to see it die. That's all a part of the responsibilities. I don't expect her not to react, but if she wants the cat, she needs to be prepared for things like that.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:49 am 
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Archer wrote:
sianblooz wrote:
Are you saying that watching your father beat your kitten to death without batting an eye means you're being raised to be a "man" ? a "woman"?


It doesn't matter what age she is. If she is old enough to have a kitten, then she is old enough to see it die. That's all a part of the responsibilities. I don't expect her not to react, but if she wants the cat, she needs to be prepared for things like that.




I don't believe that's the rule. I think it's up to the child to decide and yes it depends on the child's age and/or maturity. Wijim's daughter apparently was old enough to decide for herself. Whether she wishes to witness such an incident again only she can answer. I still can't watch an animal die - whether it's on TV or real life. When we had to euthanize our 14 year old cat due to cancer, I stayed with him right before the needle, and had to walk out of the room and leave my husband with him. I was afraid he might fight the drug and I didn't want to remember him struggling, and I was also afraid I'd be too upset in front ot the cat which would upset him. Not everyone is made from the same mold. If a child wants a pet, that doesn't mean the child should be prepared to witness its death. Understand its death, yes.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:56 am 
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sianblooz wrote:
I was going to just ignore this as its nothing but yet another attempt on your part to raise hell on the board. But, you dragged my name into it.

This is not the way you told this story before. Its also not the way you told it from the other board. I haven't read all of that thread because its one of those that goes on for miles. I don't have that link and have no interest in reading any more of this frankly disturbing story.

I think what you've written this time is self-serving pap and aimed at stirring the pot.

IF what you say is true, I agree the kitten needed killing. I don't know or care which version is true. There are so many holes in each version and its a waste of time to try to sort it all out.

Looks like you're up for Parent Of The Year Award though. :roll:

FYI, my own daughter is very close in age to yours. I would do damn near anything to protect her from seeing her own kitten beaten to death. I guess I'm just not the attentive parentyou are.



:lol: :lol: :lol:


eta:

you should have just ignored it as you have to resort to lying in order to try to scrounge up a point.

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lately i been thinkin' aunt betty stopped her blinkin'....soon she'll be a stinkin'..........my deceased mother in law speaking of her aunt who had died.


Last edited by wijim on Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:57 am 
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Grace wrote:
Archer wrote:
sianblooz wrote:
Are you saying that watching your father beat your kitten to death without batting an eye means you're being raised to be a "man" ? a "woman"?


It doesn't matter what age she is. If she is old enough to have a kitten, then she is old enough to see it die. That's all a part of the responsibilities. I don't expect her not to react, but if she wants the cat, she needs to be prepared for things like that.




I don't believe that's the rule. I think it's up to the child to decide and yes it depends on the child's age and/or maturity. Wijim's daughter apparently was old enough to decide for herself. Whether she wishes to witness such an incident again only she can answer. I still can't watch an animal die - whether it's on TV or real life. When we had to euthanize our 14 year old cat due to cancer, I stayed with him right before the needle, and had to walk out of the room and leave my husband with him. I was afraid he might fight the drug and I didn't want to remember him struggling, and I was also afraid I'd be too upset in front ot the cat which would upset him. Not everyone is made from the same mold. If a child wants a pet, that doesn't mean the child should be prepared to witness its death. Understand its death, yes.


Of course it's not the rule. It's just the way I think it should be done. The way I see it, a person shouldn't keep a pet unless they can put that pet down themself if they need to. I'd put down a pet for my kid the first time, but they would be the one doing it from then on out.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:00 am 
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Grace wrote:
sianblooz wrote:
I was going to just ignore this as its nothing but yet another attempt on your part to raise hell on the board. But, you dragged my name into it.

This is not the way you told this story before. Its also not the way you told it from the other board. I haven't read all of that thread because its one of those that goes on for miles. I don't have that link and have no interest in reading any more of this frankly disturbing story.

I think what you've written this time is self-serving pap and aimed at stirring the pot.

IF what you say is true, I agree the kitten needed killing. I don't know or care which version is true. There are so many holes in each version and its a waste of time to try to sort it all out.

Looks like you're up for Parent Of The Year Award though. :roll:

FYI, my own daughter is very close in age to yours. I would do damn near anything to protect her from seeing her own kitten beaten to death. I guess I'm just not the attentive parentyou are.



As much as I am against this type of euthanasia (more than anyone here I would wager, except maybe arc and 1 or 2 others), I don't think the kitten was beaten to death. Realistically speaking, it was, but we know it was done to end its suffering and nothing more. I try to remember (lately anyway) that my background and present situation are different from "country folk" - those who hunt, raise livestock, slaughter their own animals, and euthanize their own animals. There are plenty on this board who do all of those things. Doesn't mean it's wrong or they are being malicious. Just something I've never been exposed to and it's unsettling. Personally, I would have taken the kitten to the vet. Yes, it would have prolonged its misery, but on the other hand I'm up at 6 am everyday so I would have found it sooner than wijim did.


grace, i appreciate you putting aside the malicious way i put forth the original post and arguement to (and for) you. the deal on fmb was to pick on you specifically. thats why appreciate you speaking to it in the way you are here as opposed to us both picking up a fight where it left off.

that said. i was up at 4:30 am (or around there) and did not check the cat. when i hunt, my goal in leaving the house is not to wake anyone else. i didn't even think about the cat to check it. it was the furthest thing from my mind since both (cats) had no indication of being ill the prior evening.

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lately i been thinkin' aunt betty stopped her blinkin'....soon she'll be a stinkin'..........my deceased mother in law speaking of her aunt who had died.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:03 am 
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Grace wrote:
Archer wrote:
sianblooz wrote:
Are you saying that watching your father beat your kitten to death without batting an eye means you're being raised to be a "man" ? a "woman"?


It doesn't matter what age she is. If she is old enough to have a kitten, then she is old enough to see it die. That's all a part of the responsibilities. I don't expect her not to react, but if she wants the cat, she needs to be prepared for things like that.




I don't believe that's the rule. I think it's up to the child to decide and yes it depends on the child's age and/or maturity. Wijim's daughter apparently was old enough to decide for herself. Whether she wishes to witness such an incident again only she can answer. I still can't watch an animal die - whether it's on TV or real life. When we had to euthanize our 14 year old cat due to cancer, I stayed with him right before the needle, and had to walk out of the room and leave my husband with him. I was afraid he might fight the drug and I didn't want to remember him struggling, and I was also afraid I'd be too upset in front ot the cat which would upset him. Not everyone is made from the same mold. If a child wants a pet, that doesn't mean the child should be prepared to witness its death. Understand its death, yes.




My point of view would be that if the cat were to fight the drug I would be there to take more abrupt steps to ensure the struggle would be short. I always put the animal suffering ahead of my own emotions. I learned that as a child when I was with my dad and he always thaught me to kill with as little pain as possible. He said killing without efficency would leave a bitter taste in your mouth. He was right to, as I did learn that lesson upon occassion. Having a pig squealing in pain, makes you want to be sure the rest of your kills are deadly quick. As for WIjim and Archer's observation it seems quite likely that children who learn first hand about death will understand it much better then those who have ever seen death take over any body animal or human. We have millions of people in North America today who will never face the death of anyone but themselves. That is why we get so screwed up at the meantion of being there when an animal or loved one dies.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:04 am 
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barb, you have no children......so your attempt at lying and trying to put yourself in a position to try to show you are a parent is a moot point.

one point of evidence in that lie is...if you were a parent.....you'd understand there is more than one way of parenting and the thing you described is shallow at best, because you put forth a scenario as though your versin of parenting is the only way.

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lately i been thinkin' aunt betty stopped her blinkin'....soon she'll be a stinkin'..........my deceased mother in law speaking of her aunt who had died.


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