EnviroLink Forum

Community • Ecology • Connection
It is currently Sun Apr 20, 2014 4:19 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 115 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 4, 5, 6, 7, 8
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 1:28 pm 
Offline
Member with over 1000 posts!
Member with over 1000 posts!

Joined: Tue May 16, 2006 2:02 pm
Posts: 2314
here are the IQ scores of US Presidents:

that last one is wrong....more like 45(chuckle)

147 Franklin D. Roosevelt (D)
132 Harry Truman (D)
122 Dwight D. Eisenhower (R)
174 John F. Kennedy (D)
126 Lyndon B. Johnson (D)
155 Richard M. Nixon (R)
121 Gerald R. Ford (R)
176 James E. Carter (D)
105 Ronald W. Reagan (R)
98 George H. W. Bush (R)
182 William J. Clinton (D)
91 George W. Bush (R)

http://www.lovenstein.org/report/


ps: here's what they say about our current esteemed leader.

No president other than Carter (D) has released his actual IQ, 176. Among comments made concerning the specific testing of President GW Bush, his low ratings were due to his apparent difficulty to command the English language in public statements, his limited use of vocabulary (6,500 words for Bush versus an average of 11,000 words for other presidents), his lack of scholarly achievements other than a basic MBA, and an absence of any body of work which could be studied on an intellectual basis.

_________________
join the Ron Paul Revolution!
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/

if I could wake up tomorrow morning and push a button and all the AR's would be gone, I would lay awake tonight in anticipation of pushing the button.~~OHIOSTEVE


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 1:51 pm 
Offline
Member with 200 posts
Member with 200 posts

Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 5:50 pm
Posts: 445
Location: Alaska
Wayne Stollings wrote:
You are correct that I should have included the distribution with in the range in my haste to reply. You must assume there is an actual Gaussian/normal distribution in intelligence as measured by the IQ tests, which we know is not the case even though that is the desired effect.


No, there's no such thing as a normal distribution in intelligence. There is in the scoring of IQ tests. Two fundamentally distinct things.

Quote:
Thus, you have exhibited the flaw in your position for if it must be an equal number both above and below by definition the outcome would have to be known in advance in order to construct the scale.


uh - it is known in advance. That's exactly how it is done.

Quote:
Also by definition the current scale of IQ would be limited to an upper range of 150 to maintain the curve.


Why?

Quote:
However, my first IQ test was several percentage points above that level.


percentage points? percentage of what?

Quote:
IQ tests are designed to give approximately this Gaussian distribution.


Now didn't you just say this couldn't be the case because "the outcome would have to be known in advance in order to construct the scale."?

Quote:
IQ tests are designed to give approximately this Gaussian distribution.


All statistical measures approximate. It's not a dirty word.

_________________
I'm just a soul who's intentions are good,
Oh lord, please don't let me be misunderstood.

- The Animals


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 1:58 pm 
Offline
Member with 200 posts
Member with 200 posts

Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 5:50 pm
Posts: 445
Location: Alaska
denni50 wrote:
here are the IQ scores of US Presidents:


:wink:

http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/hoaxes/presiq.htm

_________________
I'm just a soul who's intentions are good,
Oh lord, please don't let me be misunderstood.

- The Animals


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 2:14 pm 
Offline
Member with over 1000 posts!
Member with over 1000 posts!
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 29, 2004 9:34 am
Posts: 6321
Location: Texas
denni50 wrote:
so according to the link 50% of the US population falls between
90-110...that seems awfully low.


It is low, but it seems accurate to me.

_________________
"Yes like I said it all boils down to morals. What you think is right doesn't make a person wrong because they think different ;)" X-Black


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 2:15 pm 
Offline
Member with over 1000 posts!
Member with over 1000 posts!
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 29, 2004 9:34 am
Posts: 6321
Location: Texas
denni50 wrote:
here are the IQ scores of US Presidents:

that last one is wrong....more like 45(chuckle)

147 Franklin D. Roosevelt (D)
132 Harry Truman (D)
122 Dwight D. Eisenhower (R)
174 John F. Kennedy (D)
126 Lyndon B. Johnson (D)
155 Richard M. Nixon (R)
121 Gerald R. Ford (R)
176 James E. Carter (D)
105 Ronald W. Reagan (R)
98 George H. W. Bush (R)
182 William J. Clinton (D)
91 George W. Bush (R)

http://www.lovenstein.org/report/


ps: here's what they say about our current esteemed leader.

No president other than Carter (D) has released his actual IQ, 176. Among comments made concerning the specific testing of President GW Bush, his low ratings were due to his apparent difficulty to command the English language in public statements, his limited use of vocabulary (6,500 words for Bush versus an average of 11,000 words for other presidents), his lack of scholarly achievements other than a basic MBA, and an absence of any body of work which could be studied on an intellectual basis.


I don't believe that. No matter what you think of the guy, he would have to have an I.Q. higher than that.

_________________
"Yes like I said it all boils down to morals. What you think is right doesn't make a person wrong because they think different ;)" X-Black


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 3:58 pm 
Offline
Member with over 1000 posts!
Member with over 1000 posts!
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2006 1:41 pm
Posts: 6190
I do notice that Carter and Bush's IQs do fall in line with the unemployment percentages when they were in office. 15% to 4.6% is more like 4 to 1 then 2 to 1, but the general up and down remains the same.

_________________
I don't know what your problem is but I bet its hard to pronounce.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 4:29 pm 
Offline
EnviroLink Volunteer
EnviroLink Volunteer
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2003 10:45 pm
Posts: 20354
Location: Southeastern US
Red wrote:
Wayne Stollings wrote:
You are correct that I should have included the distribution with in the range in my haste to reply. You must assume there is an actual Gaussian/normal distribution in intelligence as measured by the IQ tests, which we know is not the case even though that is the desired effect.


No, there's no such thing as a normal distribution in intelligence. There is in the scoring of IQ tests. Two fundamentally distinct things.


The scoring does not measure anything in your opinion? Odd, it does nothing and is followed so closely ....

Quote:
Quote:
Thus, you have exhibited the flaw in your position for if it must be an equal number both above and below by definition the outcome would have to be known in advance in order to construct the scale.


uh - it is known in advance. That's exactly how it is done.


No, the outcome is not known in advance or the range would be within the desired range. There is an estimated outcome that works for the largest part of the curve.

Quote:
Quote:
Also by definition the current scale of IQ would be limited to an upper range of 150 to maintain the curve.


Why?


What part of "to maintain the curve" is confusing? There is a minimal level of measurement on the lower end to offset those scores higher than the theoretical max.

Quote:
Quote:
However, my first IQ test was several percentage points above that level.


percentage points? percentage of what?


Percentage points of 150, the point I was mentioning. You know 153 IQ points would be 2% over the 150 point.

Quote:
Quote:
IQ tests are designed to give approximately this Gaussian distribution.


Now didn't you just say this couldn't be the case because "the outcome would have to be known in advance in order to construct the scale."?


Because to construct an accurate scale the outcome would have to be known and the scale adjusted accordingly.

Quote:
Quote:
IQ tests are designed to give approximately this Gaussian distribution.


All statistical measures approximate. It's not a dirty word.


It depends on how far off the approximation is from the actual. It also in interesting that the "definition" you referenced earlier is now an approximate definition ....

Now, if we were to look at what was said concerning the lower IQ levels this tangent is significantly disconnected.

_________________
With friends like Guido, you will not have enemies for long.

“Intellect is invisible to the man who has none”
Arthur Schopenhauer


"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 4:43 pm 
Offline
EnviroLink Volunteer
EnviroLink Volunteer
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2003 10:45 pm
Posts: 20354
Location: Southeastern US
To maintain the curve based solely on the IQs listed for the presidents the upper range of 182 (Clinton which is still lower than the writer Vos Savant) would leave a lower measurable range of 18. The lowest level I have seen referenced for a measurable IQ is ~40 which would limit the upper range to ~160 if you have a the correct curve. Again, I blew that curve with my first series of tests back in grade school.

Of course there is the attempt to ignore the measurement created by the tests themselves. Those scores can be used to compare people from different areas/eras if the same tests are used.

_________________
With friends like Guido, you will not have enemies for long.

“Intellect is invisible to the man who has none”
Arthur Schopenhauer


"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:02 pm 
Offline
Member with 200 posts
Member with 200 posts

Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 5:50 pm
Posts: 445
Location: Alaska
Wayne Stollings wrote:
Quote:
No, there's no such thing as a normal distribution in intelligence. There is in the scoring of IQ tests. Two fundamentally distinct things.


The scoring does not measure anything in your opinion? Odd, it does nothing and is followed so closely ....

..........



:lol:

OK. I admit you had me there for a bit. Good one. You're just making this all up as you go along, aren't you? :)









Aren't you? 8-[

_________________
I'm just a soul who's intentions are good,
Oh lord, please don't let me be misunderstood.

- The Animals


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:30 pm 
Offline
EnviroLink Volunteer
EnviroLink Volunteer
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2003 10:45 pm
Posts: 20354
Location: Southeastern US
Red wrote:
Wayne Stollings wrote:
Quote:
No, there's no such thing as a normal distribution in intelligence. There is in the scoring of IQ tests. Two fundamentally distinct things.


The scoring does not measure anything in your opinion? Odd, it does nothing and is followed so closely ....

..........



:lol:

OK. I admit you had me there for a bit. Good one. You're just making this all up as you go along, aren't you? :)









Aren't you? 8-[


MOI!? :shock: Would I do something like that just for a discussion? 8)

Am this not face of honest man? <tilting head to side and looking angelic> (Quote from ancient cartoon in Heavy Metal )

_________________
With friends like Guido, you will not have enemies for long.

“Intellect is invisible to the man who has none”
Arthur Schopenhauer


"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 115 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 4, 5, 6, 7, 8

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Exabot [Bot], Google [Bot], Yahoo [Bot] and 7 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group