EnviroLink Forum

Here is a video that shows how in Arizona, (while Utah is in felony violation of federal law).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y34U07CxVm0

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"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.
“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle
“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

The win-win scenario is if not only the illegals are made to pay the 5 to 10K fines and be deported, and Americans getting those jobs and paying taxes. AND>>> Those who have encouraged them under section iv of Title8USC1324 pay the $5K fines for each illegal---even if only one million of the more than 10 million guilty pay---that is 150 Trillion dollars! That would get us out of debt, on to infrastructure repair, and toward a steady state economy, non-emissions power and a greener country. No tax write off for more than one child and a permit required with proof of at least 105 IQ for both the mother and father, would get us toward true sustainability, and stop the dumbing down of America.
http://law.onecle.com/uscode/8/1324.html

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"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.
“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle
“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

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"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.
“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle
“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

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TANG SOO!

I had considered sneaking across the border into Mexico(illegally),but the though of death in Mexican jail just doesn't appeal to me.

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We do what we must because we can,for the good of all of us....except the ones that are dead.

Nationhood, and religion, too, both start as ideas and progress toward organization and physical realities. This thread is about >>>getting Americans back to work.<<<
Personally, I am an "Involved Deist" as per the Big Book of AA. I am not in any organized religion(all of which are hogwash to me). Now, back on subject.
The above links provide proof that Americans will take the jobs vacated by deported illegals(20+ million!), or the jobs taken by new immigrants we don't need because we are already overpopulated(see "Elephants in the Volkswagen" or "How Many Americans" both by the esteemed Lindsey Grant of NPG). The link to the laws broken with fines owed is a win-win scenario the head-in-the-sand politicians or the guilty don't want enforced. I want them enforced because we need the jobs, we need the fine money(to pay off the National Debt and prevent hyper inflation/world economic depression), and we need to reduce population to long term sustainable(deporting the 30 million illegals, both working and not, is a good start), with the corresponding reduction in emissions, other pollution and depletion of various resources.

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"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.
“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle
“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

It would be nice if the "Star Trek" fantasy of one world, then colonization of space with our numbers and control of our numbers by voluntary means on Earth. However, if I were to suddenly appear in many places of the world, I would be killed just for the way I look and talk.The problem with Homo Sapiens Sapiens, is that there is enough difference within the species, that, in a natural world, would cause speciation. Those who can and do live and understand sustainability are of a small minority of the highest intelligence, and morals, without greed. Then there is the over-breeding lower IQ majority, who are ruining the biosphere by their numbers, habits, and greed.
In a natural world, they would die out and those living sustainably would live. The species would , as before, continue to get stronger and more intelligent. Those of higher intelligence invented things that they gave to those who could not make and invent them, in the mistaken belief that over-compassion and over-tolerance was good, when it was not good for the species(only for their own "feelings"). So now, the low IQ over-breeders migrate and take down all those who can live sustainably with them, from world pollution and depletion of resources.
You mentioned outsourcing of jobs out of greed to make more money, and the fact that the overpopulated countries have lower pay, because of their overpopulation.
Another member mentioned that for the world population to really become sustainable, we would have to sterilize all below 120 IQ.
If countries could strongly enforce their borders and shores, some could "niche" themselves to be totally independent for all energy, manufacturing, and nutritional needs. Even survivalists at the village level would need to protect themselves and their property from gangs of desperate cannibals or the like.
The USA had a great immigration law from 1924, that should have been kept. However, greed and Catholic influence got the law changed in 1965, with unkept promises. The US would never have reached the gross overpopulation of now, and most of the population gain that is depleting our resources of all kinds, is from immigration both legal and illegal and their offspring from over-breeding tendencies. The allowance of birthright citizenship against the real words and spirit of the 14th Amendment, has been another big mistake. We knew about overpopulation by 1966, yet the government chose in essence, self destruction. Just like many European countries also have. So those who saw the overpopulation, then the AGW, and have tried to do something about it, have been outnumbered by >>the greedy, and over-tolerant, over-compassion infinite Earthers, and over-breeders.<<
The are the enemies of sustainability. They are the killers of future generations who will never be, and eventually, most of the life on this planet. The population crash of circa 2050 and the thermageddon extinction(estimated at 87% of all species) circa 2300-2500 is all their fault, and to me, against God's wishes for a replenished planet of people living in harmony with themselves and God's natural laws and gifts to us, and giving love to Him. Those within the arrows above will not go to Heaven, for they have defiled the planet given them, by a deadly lack of foresight of the consequences of their actions. Some may have the delusion they are going to Heaven when they will be chastised and their souls wiped out of existence.
The time for population reduction , stopping fossil fuel use, adopting a steady state economy, and "niching" countries from overpopulation caused invasions, is now. There most likely will be no second chance. Time is of the extreme essence.

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"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.
“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle
“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

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TANG SOO!

Nationhood, and religion, too, both start as ideas and progress toward organization and physical realities. This thread is about >>>getting Americans back to work.<<<

Yeah, I know what the thread is about and what your idea is, but I am suggesting that your concern is not rooted in anything other than fear. Your concern also comes from this ingrained belief that you are an American citizen and that borders are an actuality. Borders ARE an actuality on a certain level .... the level that many of us have agreed on as an idea. But they are still only ideas. Paper tigers.

Personally, I am an "Involved Deist" as per the Big Book of AA.

You say that as if you think I know what you're talking about, and I don't. What is an "Invloved Deist" and what is the "Big Book of AA"? I am interested to know and, having said that, I am also comparing religious beliefs with the belief in nationhood which is really just an identification with some nation-state which in turn is an idea just as religion or "God" is a belief or idea. People also identify themselves with God. I think identifiication with either is not real.

I am not in any organized religion(all of which are hogwash to me). Now, back on subject.
The above links provide proof that Americans will take the jobs vacated by deported illegals(20+ million!), or the jobs taken by new immigrants we don't need because we are already overpopulated(see "Elephants in the Volkswagen" or "How Many Americans" both by the esteemed Lindsey Grant of NPG). The link to the laws broken with fines owed is a win-win scenario the head-in-the-sand politicians or the guilty don't want enforced. I want them enforced because we need the jobs, we need the fine money(to pay off the National Debt and prevent hyper inflation/world economic depression), and we need to reduce population to long term sustainable(deporting the 30 million illegals, both working and not, is a good start), with the corresponding reduction in emissions, other pollution and depletion of various resources.

You may have escaped the snares of organized religion but you've not escaped the beliefs of organized nationhood. Both are deeply ingrained in the human psyche which is a shared consciousness. That little boy in Bangledesh shares your consciousness regardless of citizenship, his or yours, and both fates are intertwined. If you are truly concerned about the planet, you will see it as a whole because a planet is a whole despite the boundaries we have carved out. The boundaries are an idea while the planet itself is a reality. If you want to reduce population you need to think about reducing globally - not just nationally. If you deport the 30 million, those 30 milliion still exist on the planet. Tossing them over some idea of border will never reduce numbers, emissions or other pollution. You cannot ever secure the integrity and security of that place which is called the United States if other so callled nations are not also secure. The pollution that those 30 million produce is not dependent on borders because, very realistically. there are none. Pollution knows no borders. Depletion of resources ultimately has no citizenship. So why do you adhere to your so called citizenship? If you don't mind me saying, it's not rational.

Most of us want to belong to some group because it gives us some notion of psychological security. The need and insistence on psychological security only creates actual, physical and very real insecurity. We are not actually divided by these beliefs as they are only beliefs. But yet again, we are truly divided by these beliefs because they are beliefs.

Why have any belief at all? That boy in Bangledesh suffers needlessly because of them.

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"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.
“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle
“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

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TANG SOO!

Y'all are just iggernent rednecks .... peace love and fuzzy feelings are all you really need until the folks in the valley want your treasure.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTKx2f44 ... re=related

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With friends like Guido, you will not have enemies for long.

“Intellect is invisible to the man who has none”
Arthur Schopenhauer

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein