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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 2:05 pm 
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I think that I would eat a human before eating a house cat. Humans are the most plentiful big game animal on Earth, and their numbers are ruining the Earth for themselves and all other life. A REAL environmentalist and person who cares about other animal life, would be a cannibal, technically. :lol: :mrgreen: #-o =; :-

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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 5:47 pm 
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Johhny Electriglide wrote:
I think that I would eat a human before eating a house cat. Humans are the most plentiful big game animal on Earth, and their numbers are ruining the Earth for themselves and all other life. A REAL environmentalist and person who cares about other animal life, would be a cannibal, technically. :lol: :mrgreen: #-o =; :-


Long pig eh? You ain't of the nephilim breed are you?
The most intelligent ? Yet most dangerous to the world. And I bet most tastiest!

What I want to know is does the eating of meat exclude the moral ethical man of all guilt and concience or does it condemn him to a guilt that preys on his mind in the same way his tastebuds indirectly preyed on the slaughtered beast?
Maybes the annunaki are gonna tell us what real feasting is all about. Hoi you tall tosser that was my leg I was very attached to that. Why have I always hated the phrase 'I'm gonna have a ball'.


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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 5:59 pm 
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I'm a farmer. I eat meat. Why be vegan? I can understand vegetarianism, really I can. Not everyone wants to kill stuff. Milk, eggs, and beans can supply you with everything you need. That being said, I have never understood veganism and never will. What is the point? Do you not want animals to even exist? If they exist, what is against using them? Without us, many domesticated animals would not even exist.


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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:41 am 
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Having a vegan diet means trying to minimise suffering. Vegetariansim does't come as close to the minimising of suffering. Milk was meant for the calf, we are the only mature species thet drink milk apart from cats. There is scientific proof that a bereavement occurs between the mother cow and calf when they are separated then the frightened calf is put in a crate and fed a milk substitute. In the egg laying industry the male chicks are either gassed or fed live into a mincing machine. Of course there is cruelty in arable farming but that is not intentional.
Sure they wouldn't exist but that which never existed could never have suffered.
Indeed it would be sad to see green fields void of sheep and cattle but if that meant no intensive farming and no slaughterhouses that would be fine by me.

I can jump over the fence and see where you are coming from but I have a different belief rightly or wrongly.

Whats your thoughts on intensive farming?


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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:00 am 
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mothy wrote:
Having a vegan diet means trying to minimise suffering. Vegetariansim does't come as close to the minimising of suffering. Milk was meant for the calf, we are the only mature species thet drink milk apart from cats.


and dogs and most other animals if given the chance.


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There is scientific proof that a bereavement occurs between the mother cow and calf when they are separated then the frightened calf is put in a crate and fed a milk substitute.


Or fed milk to get the good milk-fed veal.


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In the egg laying industry the male chicks are either gassed or fed live into a mincing machine.


As opposed to the natural losses to egg laying species in the wild.

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Of course there is cruelty in arable farming but that is not intentional.


So why do they not just prevent it? That's right, it cannot be prevented. So the "intentional" definition is tweaked to try to make it work.


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Sure they wouldn't exist but that which never existed could never have suffered.


No life is better than life? Why is it then life seems to struggle to continue even through suffering?


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I can jump over the fence and see where you are coming from but I have a different belief rightly or wrongly.


On this we can agree.

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Whats your thoughts on intensive farming?


Unless we remove a whole bunch of people form the equation, it is necessary.

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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:40 am 
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Calves are fed a milk substitute based on a dried milk powder because it is cheaper.

Chicks in the wild are prone to animals that do not have our potential for empathy and altruism.

Instinct is stronger than reason.


Last edited by mothy on Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:45 am 
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mothy wrote:
Having a vegan diet means trying to minimise suffering.


Funny. I could say the same thing about my meat-inclusive diet.

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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:52 am 
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Fosgate wrote:
mothy wrote:
Having a vegan diet means trying to minimise suffering.


Funny. I could say the same thing about my meat-inclusive diet.


Not on your intestines it doesn't.


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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 11:30 am 
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mothy wrote:
Not on your intestines it doesn't.


My intestines, Mothy? Why, they're quite alright. Try again.

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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 11:38 am 
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mothy wrote:
Calves are fed a milk substitute based on a dried milk powder because it is cheaper.


Odd, it seems that is not always the case ......

http://www.hubbellfarm.com/beef/

We have our own Jersey cow who gives us milk, butter and cheese. She produces more than we can use. We also raise a limited number of milk fed veal. These veal are not contained in a small compartment and fed milk substitute. They are fed whole milk, fresh from the cow and have the opportunity to live out their life in a healthy open environment.

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Chicks in the wild are prone to animals that do not have our potential for empathy and altruism.


Death is not death if the cause is lacking the potential for empathy? Suffering is not suffering if the cause is lacking the potential for empathy?


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Instinct is stronger than reason.


Not always. Instinct says to run from a fire, yet firemen counter that with the use of reason and approach the fire.

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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 12:39 pm 
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Fosgate wrote:
mothy wrote:
Not on your intestines it doesn't.


My intestines, Mothy? Why, they're quite alright. Try again.


http://www.indiasurgeons.com/cacolon.htm

cough cough. Or should I fart fart!


Last edited by mothy on Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 12:56 pm 
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Wayne Stollings wrote:
mothy wrote:
Calves are fed a milk substitute based on a dried milk powder because it is cheaper.


Odd, it seems that is not always the case ......

http://www.hubbellfarm.com/beef/

We have our own Jersey cow who gives us milk, butter and cheese. She produces more than we can use. We also raise a limited number of milk fed veal. These veal are not contained in a small compartment and fed milk substitute. They are fed whole milk, fresh from the cow and have the opportunity to live out their life in a healthy open environment.

Quote:
Chicks in the wild are prone to animals that do not have our potential for empathy and altruism.


Death is not death if the cause is lacking the potential for empathy? Suffering is not suffering if the cause is lacking the potential for empathy?


Quote:
Instinct is stronger than reason.


Not always. Instinct says to run from a fire, yet firemen counter that with the use of reason and approach the fire.



I 'm not talking about a highly trained fireman I'm talking about the basic sexual drive. Thinking with the wrong head comes to mind. So many abortions don't you think? and that is humans

The penquin doesn't think 'hey I really fancy you but I must refrain from any sexual urge cos the chicks will be freezing in this climate'. And yes they do suffer.

death is death in the objective sense whether its accompanied by subjectivity that is endowed upon the deceased by a living sentient or not. although dying is real to the victim.

And I ain't talking about the small farm that is full of compassion which many are but the industrial side of the market.


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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 2:02 pm 
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One other thing. You made no reference when I mentioned the frightened calf. Do I conclude you accept this as part of mans ill-gotten gains?


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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 2:11 pm 
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mothy wrote:
Fosgate wrote:
mothy wrote:
Not on your intestines it doesn't.


My intestines, Mothy? Why, they're quite alright. Try again.


http://www.indiasurgeons.com/cacolon.htm

cough cough. Or should I fart fart!


Makes no difference to me. I don't have colon cancer.

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 Post subject: Re: vegan
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 2:43 pm 
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mothy wrote:
One other thing. You made no reference when I mentioned the frightened calf. Do I conclude you accept this as part of mans ill-gotten gains?


Animals are often easily frightened by many things, especially younger animals.

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