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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:20 am 
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How would it affect your civil liberties if you are dead? When you are alive you can opt out so you are not been forced to do anything...

Just notice that this thread is ancient!


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:02 am 
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tommee wrote:
How would it affect your civil liberties if you are dead? When you are alive you can opt out so you are not been forced to do anything...

Just notice that this thread is ancient!
The last will and testament of people is held in rather high regard by some people... especially if they think they need their body in one piece for their journey into the afterlife. Of course it also includes the fate and emotional journey of their relatives and dependents.

Note that I did not start the thread but obviously was not active here when the thread was


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:05 am 
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Ann Vole wrote:
tommee wrote:
How would it affect your civil liberties if you are dead? When you are alive you can opt out so you are not been forced to do anything...

Just notice that this thread is ancient!
The last will and testament of people is held in rather high regard by some people... especially if they think they need their body in one piece for their journey into the afterlife. Of course it also includes the fate and emotional journey of their relatives and dependents.

Note that I did not start the thread but obviously was not active here when the thread was



I can understand what you say but if it's an opt out and you feel so strong then opt out....

Problem we face is that many people do want to donate but don't bother to carry a card or talk about it.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:12 am 
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Ann Vole wrote:
In terms of civil liberties, the current way is only slightly "better" then the proposed way as long as the process of registering your exception clear and without loop-holes. In terms of saving lives with these organs, it will make a huge difference in time it takes to make sure you have approval to use them and are able to inform those receiving the organ to prepare for surgery. It might also be a thing of pride for those with religious objections to wear a bracelet saying that they are not donors and include a registration number of their complaint. This might not work though if they also object to "jewelry" and tattoos (such as some Hutterites/Mennonites) but that is just an option... body identification still needs to be done. If you have seen the Max Headroom shows and pilot movie, you will know of another potential problem (but this is a "slippery slope" argument) in people being killed and then sold on the black market under a fake name for their organs.


Yes, a change to an assumed donor unless differently notified would increase the possibility of abuse within the system over the current system. Even now if one is a documented donor and the legal next of kin refuse for whatever reason, the donation will not be taken in many cases.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 6:01 pm 
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What is with a couple of fruitcake newbies dredging up old threads, without any intros?????
This was an ignorant thread from the start and should have died..........
(ignorant because the persons did not know about diseases in the blood and organs like Hep C and cancers) [-X =P~ [-( :x ](*,) :twisted:
then you have the 1989 book author still trying to sell it. Spam, and 3 more than mothy who make numerous inane comments, and I thought one was bad enough!! #-o :-& =;

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 8:55 am 
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Johhny Electriglide wrote:
What is with a couple of fruitcake newbies dredging up old threads, without any intros?????
This was an ignorant thread from the start and should have died..........


Excuse me..? Why are you calling people fruit cakes? Not very nice. I have even mentioned it was an old thread.

Quote:
(ignorant because the persons did not know about diseases in the blood and organs like Hep C and cancers) [-X =P~ [-( :x ](*,) :twisted:
then you have the 1989 book author still trying to sell it. Spam, and 3 more than mothy who make numerous inane comments, and I thought one was bad enough!! #-o :-& =;


Did you not know that donated organs are screened for infection etc..? Who's the ignorant one on this I ask myself..


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 10:14 am 
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tommee wrote:

Did you not know that donated organs are screened for infection etc..? Who's the ignorant one on this I ask myself..


Cancer may not be found even in a screening and may be introduced into a donor.


http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,344 ... z1sgTwXKj0

The family of a 15-year-old New York boy thought they were helping him to live on by donating his organs.


Instead, the organs spread a rare, undiagnosed cancer to the four transplant recipients, according to a report from WCBSTV.com.


Alex Koehne of Sag Harbor, Long Island, died a year ago of lymphoma, but his parents were told he died from bacterial meningitis. Since then, two of the organ recipients have died and two others are battling the same disease, according to the report.


Jim and Lisa Koehne asked for an autopsy following their son's death, according to the report. A month later they found out Alex actually had died of a rare lymphoma; the organs, however, already had been donated.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 11:18 am 
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Wayne Stollings wrote:
tommee wrote:

Did you not know that donated organs are screened for infection etc..? Who's the ignorant one on this I ask myself..


Cancer may not be found even in a screening and may be introduced into a donor.


http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,344 ... z1sgTwXKj0

The family of a 15-year-old New York boy thought they were helping him to live on by donating his organs.


Instead, the organs spread a rare, undiagnosed cancer to the four transplant recipients, according to a report from WCBSTV.com.


Alex Koehne of Sag Harbor, Long Island, died a year ago of lymphoma, but his parents were told he died from bacterial meningitis. Since then, two of the organ recipients have died and two others are battling the same disease, according to the report.


Jim and Lisa Koehne asked for an autopsy following their son's death, according to the report. A month later they found out Alex actually had died of a rare lymphoma; the organs, however, already had been donated.



And it's rare... Doctors give you all the information about the risks giving you chance to make an informed decision. The alternative would be....


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 11:59 am 
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tommee wrote:
Wayne Stollings wrote:
tommee wrote:

Did you not know that donated organs are screened for infection etc..? Who's the ignorant one on this I ask myself..


Cancer may not be found even in a screening and may be introduced into a donor.


http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,344 ... z1sgTwXKj0

The family of a 15-year-old New York boy thought they were helping him to live on by donating his organs.


Instead, the organs spread a rare, undiagnosed cancer to the four transplant recipients, according to a report from WCBSTV.com.


Alex Koehne of Sag Harbor, Long Island, died a year ago of lymphoma, but his parents were told he died from bacterial meningitis. Since then, two of the organ recipients have died and two others are battling the same disease, according to the report.


Jim and Lisa Koehne asked for an autopsy following their son's death, according to the report. A month later they found out Alex actually had died of a rare lymphoma; the organs, however, already had been donated.



And it's rare... Doctors give you all the information about the risks giving you chance to make an informed decision. The alternative would be....



So how did that relate to the statement:

Quote:
Quote:
(ignorant because the persons did not know about diseases in the blood and organs like Hep C and cancers)
then you have the 1989 book author still trying to sell it. Spam, and 3 more than mothy who make numerous inane comments, and I thought one was bad enough!!


Did you not know that donated organs are screened for infection etc..? Who's the ignorant one on this I ask myself..


The lack of knowledge of disease in the blood and organs would make one ignorant of that fact and knowing there could be some screening does not eliminate the risk or the lack of knowledge of the possible diseease vector.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 1:37 pm 
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Wayne Stollings wrote:
Quote:
(ignorant because the persons did not know about diseases in the blood and organs like Hep C and cancers)
then you have the 1989 book author still trying to sell it. Spam, and 3 more than mothy who make numerous inane comments, and I thought one was bad enough!!


Did you not know that donated organs are screened for infection etc..? Who's the ignorant one on this I ask myself..


Quote:
The lack of knowledge of disease in the blood and organs would make one ignorant of that fact and knowing there could be some screening does not eliminate the risk or the lack of knowledge of the possible diseease vector.



No it shows that the risks are low enough for donated organ donation to be practised world wide and it saves lives.

I didn't claim there was no risk.

Very negative posting coming from the regulars, if you don't want me here just say so and I will vacate this place without a problem. I don't think it would help matters if people are allowed to insult others, is this how things work around here.

I've been called a fruit cake twice on this forum and would expect a moderator to take action, it offend me.

I wonder if Mr electric boogaloo would refuse a donated organ...


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 3:33 pm 
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tommee wrote:
Wayne Stollings wrote:
Quote:
(ignorant because the persons did not know about diseases in the blood and organs like Hep C and cancers)
then you have the 1989 book author still trying to sell it. Spam, and 3 more than mothy who make numerous inane comments, and I thought one was bad enough!!


Did you not know that donated organs are screened for infection etc..? Who's the ignorant one on this I ask myself..


Quote:
The lack of knowledge of disease in the blood and organs would make one ignorant of that fact and knowing there could be some screening does not eliminate the risk or the lack of knowledge of the possible diseease vector.



No it shows that the risks are low enough for donated organ donation to be practised world wide and it saves lives.


Which has nothing at all to do with your statement concerning ignorance and screening.

Quote:
I didn't claim there was no risk.


No, I just was being complete in my statement.

Quote:
Very negative posting coming from the regulars, if you don't want me here just say so and I will vacate this place without a problem. I don't think it would help matters if people are allowed to insult others, is this how things work around here.


Wait, you tossed a couple of insults at me and now you have a problem with it?

Quote:
I've been called a fruit cake twice on this forum and would expect a moderator to take action, it offend me.


Does that mean a moderator should take action for your insults or is it just a double standard?

Quote:
I wonder if Mr electric boogaloo would refuse a donated organ...


It might depend on the donor or the circumstances ... or not.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:16 pm 
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Wayne Stollings wrote:

It might depend on the donor or the circumstances ... or not.



You can show me the insults I offered, I'm wouldn't say the word ignorance is an insult, fruit cake is but I get the way this place works so now.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:22 pm 
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tommee wrote:
Wayne Stollings wrote:

It might depend on the donor or the circumstances ... or not.



You can show me the insults I offered,


and show you to be a total ... that would be rude.

Quote:
I'm wouldn't say the word ignorance is an insult,


Nor would I. It is a statement of fact in many cases. It is a statement of false opinion in others.


Quote:
fruit cake is but I get the way this place works so now.


I suppose it depends on whether you like fruitcake or not.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:31 pm 
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Wayne Stollings wrote:
tommee wrote:

and show you to be a total ... that would be rude.


That depends of how you think. I would have said "waste of time debating with" but you though different, your standard.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:51 pm 
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tommee wrote:
Wayne Stollings wrote:
tommee wrote:

and show you to be a total ... that would be rude.


That depends of how you think. I would have said "waste of time debating with" but you though different, your standard.


So now you know that offense can only be taken and not given .... right? 8)

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