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EnviroLink Forum • View topic - Reasonable gun control measures

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:54 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 1:31 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 2:24 pm 
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I still haven't seen any proof of Obama's Citizenship that has not been deemed fake/altered/fraudulent by expert forensic document analysis. (sure, bought off people in Hawaii have said it is genuine when one retired from their records branch had said before it didn't exist back before 2008.)<<< I quit the NRA when they started catering to Hispanics with Spanish language. Then I rejoined when it was apparent they were the best org for keeping 2nd Amendment Rights.(which includes the individual's right to bear arms "shall not be infringed", ralfy).
If they go with the same assault rifle ban and 10 rd mag max, I will have to take off the pike on my SKS and put a plug in my 13 rd. P14 mags. Still, we have been outgunned by our government since around the 1930s. It would be tough to do the Tom Jefferson thing, like in the Declaration of Independence, >>which is part of what the 2nd Amend. was for.<<<
In 1776 there were a lot less people and more wild predators. Now there are 124 times the people and many of them are wild predators. From overpopulation.org;
"Through immigration and high birth rates, the United States is expected to add another 100 million people by 2050. We've already added 105 million people since 1970; we have a net gain of one person every 13 seconds."(that is less than 6 minutes to get 26 people).<<<
>>>The need for self protection is just as big as ever. We have been under invasion from Mexico for 30 years yet are not allowed to stop it. I am not allowed to live up to my Military Oath that I never rescinded(how about the Citizen's Militia to stop the invasion!!!). Felony conduct in Washington, city and state governments and by citizens is not punished, and if I tried to make a lawful citizen's arrest of them, I would be thrown in jail.(they owe a $5K fine for each of the 30 million illegals robbing our gov't and people's jobs and wages!!)<< USC1324iv Felony
A hundred million get punished for the acts of 3 who should have been locked up in nut wards, for schools that forbid firearms except to the nuts and criminals. A million criminals will still have forbidden weapons, and >>>millions more will still be getting away with their crimes, whose fines could pay off the National Debt.<<<(you forgot to answer this one, Wayne!).
The crime of killing billions in future generations with depletion and pollution effects will still go on.<<<<(how about this one?)
In the sixties we had the guy with a brain tumor up in a tower. >>Overpopulation was not dealt with<< and now we have the 3 >recent< nut cases. >>As crowding gets worse, so do hostility, depression and anxiety disorders. If the nuts don't have guns to steal, they use gasoline, knives/machetes, or pointed sticks, as more people go insane with overcrowding, lowering wages, lack of work, rising costs, or pollution poisoning.<<
>> We don't read about the deaths caused by introduced diseases from illegals.<< >>>The seven thousand of guns given to drug dealers(under Obama) is compared equally(by liberals) to another failed program that gave a two hundred guns to them(under Bush). Obama/Holder's guns have been linked to hundreds of Mexican deaths and one Border Patrol Agent's death, which they are criminally liable for! >>>While effective programs to get out criminals are stopped (i.e. 287g) by a criminal admin. <<<<!!!!!! (Tyrannical gov't of Obama).............
Guns take hundreds of years to wear out, if maintained. Citizen's semi-autos are offset by moslem, commie, and criminal's AK & other fully automatic weapons (criminals including some of those working for the gov't, local, state, or Federal).
The danger to US citizens increases............!!!!!<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Et tu, Brute? (Wayne)

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Last edited by Johhny Electriglide on Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:06 pm 
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To recap what I shared earlier:

The U.S. has higher crimes attributed to guns compared to various OECD countries, and the reason is obvious: more guns, more incidences of crime, etc. involving guns.

The Second Amendment is not about the right to bear arms. That right is part of English common law, which means it doesn't need to be approved by government. In short, the right to bear arms takes place by default, and does not need to be mentioned in the Constitution or statutes.

What, then, is the Second Amendment about? It is not about the right to bear arms. Rather, it is about the need to form well-regulated militias using the right to bear arms as justification. That is why we have the Militia Acts that followed the amendment. The statutes required almost all white, able-bodied males of a certain age to acquire weapons (muskets, the equivalent of assault or battle rifles) and then train with a militia twice a year. The militia is answerable to the POTUS. Thus, the Second Amendment is NOT about a militia that is meant to protect against "government tyranny." It is a reserve force regulated by the government. Subsequent acts made this statute permanent, included African-American males, and called for the formation of a National Guard. Later, conscription was removed.

Thus, the second amendment obliges citizens (at least male adults of a certain age range) to buy assault weapons (or to be provided weapons by the government) and to train with a militia. If it is the National Guard, then training involving armored vehicles, etc., are included. Since such a provision involves training (which is part of gun control), then gun control does not go against the Second Amendment and is not unconstitutional.

In addition, gun control does not violate the right to bear arms. That's because the right to bear arms is one that takes place by default but may be abridged by the law. That's why convicts, for example, are not allowed to bear arms.

Finally, behind all of this is the arms industry. That is, the arms industry profits by selling weapons to civilians. The same arms industry lobbies the government and successfully convinces the latter to set aside gun control. Meanwhile, the same arms industry sells the same weapons (and better) to the same government and profits from that. This allows the police and military to form some of the most formidable surveillance and even prison systems in the world. With that, gun control is replaced by police systems to control civilians with weapons provided by the arms industry that supplies the same weapons (and more) to the police and military.

Next, the same arms industry lobbies government to deregulate arms exports, thus allowing it to profit from sales to many countries, thus making the U.S. the main arms dealer of the world. Why does the government agree? Because the same arms industry sells weapons, etc., to the military, which is used to prop up the petro-dollar, which allows the U.S. to borrow and spend easily. The same arms are used as part of military aid for some countries or even groups used to gain strategic advantages for the U.S., to control particular resources, or even to destabilize various governments. Arms dealers sell to various criminal groups.

Meanwhile, utterly naive citizens think that with small arms they will be able to avoid "tyranny" from a government armed with better weapons, armored vehicles, ground-attack aircraft, missiles, artillery, etc., supplied by the same defense industry that sold small arms to them. Eventually, they face armed threat from fellow citizens, several of which face problems described in this article:

http://lewrockwell.com/orig12/shield2.1.1.html

increasing brutality from police and even military personnel, and criminal groups who all acquired armaments from the same sources.

With that, expect more tragedies, more armaments bought and sold not only in the U.S. worldwide (and with that more profits for the arms industry), more lobbying from the arms industry insisting that more guns are needed, more beefed up police and military forces, growing control through surveillance and prison systems, and amplified effects of gun use as social crises worsen.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:40 pm 
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 1:00 pm 
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Steven Davis, a well liked math and science teacher, who studied CIA manuals and military type training, posted some youtube vids making statements such as , ....

"the school system is sick and needs to be healed".

"I'm going to shut the system down."

"This is very well planned and thought out. It's all going to come down so hard."

"I'm going to shut the system down until they get things straight."

Police went to his home and confiscated an AR-15, the same weapon used in Newtown.

http://wnyt.com/article/stories/s2884030.shtml?cat=300


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:02 am 
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Related:

"The Sandy Hook Massacre and the Merchant$ of Death"

"Americans need to understand that the NRA is very much a part of this global arms trade. If one follows the money, the reasons why the NRA is adamantly opposed to any sort of regulation on guns becomes painfully apparent. While the US domestic arms industry conveniently wraps itself and its profit motive behind the patriotic fervor of the Second Amendment and the colonial ghosts of Founding Fathers, the horrors of the Sandy Hook massacre are blamed on everything under the sun except for that which hides in plain sight — an unregulated, out-of-control global and domestic arms industry."

http://collapseofindustrialcivilization ... -of-death/


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:15 pm 
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Corruption of all kinds would be nice to get rid of. Kind of a good site, ralfy, where I found this, which is very good;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hM1x4RljmnE

One aspect of the corruption is that those 26 people were replaced by immigrants in less than 6 minutes. That is as much or more of a sickening fact than the looney kid who was the shooter.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:04 pm 
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Re: exponential growth, reminds me of Bartlett.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:06 am 
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