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Wayne, a mud-pack, when conceived ideologically, is still a mud-pack. The idea, even when politically conceived, is still mud. How objective is mud ...
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Mud would always be objective, but the ideology you referenced in relation would almost always be subjective. Again this question reinforces the futility of such a discussion given the lack of understanding between what is objective and subjective it displays.
Borders are made of mud. Mud is mud. What are borders?
And what do you mean, ... "the ideology I referenced ... " What ideology are you talking about sonce I haven't offered one? Ideology is the stuff of borders. Ideology is the idea behind the mud. If the ideas did not exist, mud still would, but it wouldn't be organized into the structure we call a "border". Both mud and borders are things, but borders are man made while mud is not. That's all. It's so simple, no?[/quote]
And DO remember that it was you that quoted this author:
"....Examples of objective reality would include the position of objects in space, the chemical structure of molecules, the force of gravity, and planetary orbits."
And I might add ....mud, soil, dirt, bricks, etc.
The author you cited went on to say that .... "Examples of subjective reality include all our opinions, ideas, and words for molecules and planets, ... "
Molecules are part of both mud, and the walls we make of mud.
" ..... whether things are good or bad or right or wrong, all thoughts and emotions, political ideologies, religions, and any social phenomenon. In other words, most of what we call reality is political opinion is a different thing. Actually subjective reality, and we often confuse subjective reality with objective reality, mainly because it seems so real that it seems impossible to us that it actually exists only within the human mind.
Like borders ...... which are made out of mud .... objective mud. The meaning we give to this mud is subjective. While mud is objective, the meaning we give to mud is subjective.
The author you provided also stated that ...
"Subjective reality can also seem like objective reality when many people agree on and share the subjective reality."
And have we not agreed that mud can be borders? Mud is objective ... borders are nothing more or less than the meaning we give to them. Borders are not real and no arguing for the objectivity of mud can make them so.